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How do you all feel about it?   Is there anyone who is agnostic?  What is some good reasons atheism could be right?  What are some reasons to be skeptical?   

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There is no proof that any kind of deity or divine being exists or ever did exist. The vast majority of the world believes that one does, but belief is not proof.

People believe that the earth is flat.
People believe that giraffes don't exist. I'm not even kidding about that. There's an entire reddit forum about it, that is not satire.
People believe aliens built the pyramids.

 

Just because someone believes in something does not make it true, real, or fact.

I could believe that 2+2=5, but that doesn't make it true.

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9 hours ago, Jayson said:

How do you all feel about it?   Is there anyone who is agnostic?  What is some good reasons atheism could be right?  What are some reasons to be skeptical?   

 

Well let me ask this.  What good reasons are there to believe that any religion is right?  Is there any existing evidence of the claims of deities and miracles that have any real credibility whatsoever?

 

I'm so sick and tired of these assholes who say "Prove that it's wrong". NO!!!  If you're making outrageous claims that some guy born to a virgin, was able to walk on water, turn water into wine, cure disease by touch and even raise people from the dead...  YOUR the one with burden of proof. You could play that bullshit card with almost anything.  I could say Star Wars is true story.  It happened a long time ago in a galaxy far, far away therefore it's right because you can't prove it's wrong....  That's not how basic reasoning and logic works.

 

The truth is, that so many just refuse to accept, there isn't any proof.  Not only that, but the claims made in scriptures like the Bible have been debunked countless times.  We know the Earth was not made in 7 days. We know that human race could not have been bread from just 2 ancestors and don't even get me started about Noah's Ark.

 

The worst thing though is the people take advantage of others "faith" in this crap.  To push political and social policy that discriminates and cause legitimate harm to others.  God is by far mankind's biggest mistake.

Edited by Crazycrab
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I was brought up with religious values, but I never was a practitioner of any faith. For the most part I did not think of god at all.

I don't know if there was a clear crossover point when I become an atheist. It's just that I realized the absurdity of the whole ordeal.

  1. If god is all knowing and all seeing, why does anyone pray for anything? It should already know what you want.
  2. They also say that god has a plan for everyone. If so, that again makes praying pointless. Do you presume to have a better plan than god?
  3. If god knows everything why do you need to confess your sins?
  4. And the most absurd thing is that all your sins can be washed away by asking for forgiveness from god. Not the people you wronged, who cares about them, it's god you need to appease.
  5. They also say god made humans in his own image. It seems to me that it is the other way around. Humans made god based on themselves, with all our faults and vices included. The abrahamic god, is petty, vengeful, jealous, has a fragile ego, and strangely holds to the exact values held by people around the time of his emergence.
  6. If god actually existed as described by scripture, I'd be working on bringing down the bastard, I'd not worship that cruel egomaniac.

 

As for agnosticism, I think that is even less of a defensible position. I can pardon believers for being deluded or mislead, what excuse the agnostic has? If I said that there is a giant red ant in the middle of earth responsible for rotating it, that is not observable either, so should we go on living not knowing if there is an ant rotating the earth? Of course not. Without proof it's just an assertion. Assertions need scientific reproducable proof to evolve into theory. God has exactly the same amount of proof as my red ant: ZERO.

Edited by m76
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Well, Christianity is about faith, so it's never been about proof anyway.  However, why do people need proof of everything?  Can everything be proved?   Anyway, some scientists have talked about things that seem very Biblical.

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On 3/13/2022 at 6:03 AM, Jayson said:

Well, Christianity is about faith, so it's never been about proof anyway.  However, why do people need proof of everything?  Can everything be proved?   Anyway, some scientists have talked about things that seem very Biblical.

 

Religion is used and/or has been used as justification for murder, torture, war, slavery, genocide, bullshit scientific theory and discrimination against race, gender and sexuality.  If religion is pushing for these kind social or political policy's based purely on its doctrine, then that doctrine DAMN sure better have proof!

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They have the right to their own opinion, even if it's wrong and will condemn them to an eternity of hellfire and having to listen to Trump talking non-stop about himself. 😄

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On 3/13/2022 at 7:03 AM, Jayson said:

Well, Christianity is about faith, so it's never been about proof anyway.  However, why do people need proof of everything?  Can everything be proved?   Anyway, some scientists have talked about things that seem very Biblical.

Of course faith is not about proof, that's exactly its problem. Religion wants us to think that faith in of itself is a virtue.

Believing outlandish claims without scrutinizing their validity in the slightest is not a virtue, it is called gullibility.

Not everything can be proven, but those things that can't or can't yet we do not base our lives around, we live under the assumption that they are untrue, well most of us at least.

The irony is that the most devout believers also live their life outside their preaching and prayers as if god did not exist. You never see a religious person jump off the roof, and say, oh if  god wants me around he'll catch me. Why does the pope need a bullet proof car, if everything is god's will? Surely then him getting assassinated is also god's will, how dare he oppose god's will then? See how easy it is to poke holes in faith? It's illogical and unreasonable.

Some scientists are religious, I personally don't understand how can they reconcile that in their head, but as long as their science is not tainted by their religion it doesn't matter.

The mistake most theologians make, is that they pre-suppose the answer and try to build a theory that supports their desired outcome. That's not how science works. You follow the evidence wherever it takes you.

Edited by m76
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On 3/13/2022 at 12:03 AM, Jayson said:

Anyway, some scientists have talked about things that seem very Biblical.

That's how you create 'scientific martyrs' like Galileo who the Catholic church prosecuted for saying Earth revolves around the sun and not the other way around. Church and state should always be separated, otherwise science gets attacked. Under the trump administration, he banned 7 words from the CDC: diversity, entitlement, evidence-based, fetus, science-based, transgender, and vulnerable. And they also interfered with CDC reports about Covid to disinform the people, and even appointed a goon to put in charge of the CDC who was forced to go on leave of absence for being delusional, inciting violence, and being extremely politically polarized. 

I don’t understand how you could ask if atheism is right. You categorize atheism as a belief but it’s not an organization. They don’t get tax breaks for being atheist. They don’t knock on your door. They don’t baptize. And they don’t sing choir or hymns from scriptures. Atheism isn’t right or wrong. It's just rational. 

Edited by Reality vs Adventure
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13 hours ago, Reality vs Adventure said:

That's how you create 'scientific martyrs' like Galileo who the Catholic church prosecuted for saying Earth revolves around the sun and not the other way around. Church and state should always be separated, otherwise science gets attacked. Under the trump administration, he banned 7 words from the CDC: diversity, entitlement, evidence-based, fetus, science-based, transgender, and vulnerable. And they also interfered with CDC reports about Covid to disinform the people, and even appointed a goon to put in charge of the CDC who was forced to go on leave of absence for being delusional, inciting violence, and being extremely politically polarized. 

I don’t understand how you could ask if atheism is right. You categorize atheism as a belief but it’s not an organization. They don’t get tax breaks for being atheist. They don’t knock on your door. They don’t baptize. And they don’t sing choir or hymns from scriptures. Atheism isn’t right or wrong. It's just rational. 

Kids shouldn't be exposed to the extreme cultural left agenda.  Well, at the least, states should be free to decide if they want Critical Race Theory etc. taught in schools or not.  A lot of people simply don't agree with it.  These people are not monsters or KKK.  They just aren't into the "extreme cultural left".

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6 minutes ago, Jayson said:

Kids shouldn't be exposed to the extreme cultural left agenda.  Well, at the least, states should be free to decide if they want Critical Race Theory etc. taught in schools or not.  A lot of people simply don't agree with it.  These people are not monsters or KKK.  They just aren't into the "extreme cultural left".

I think you posted that on the wrong topic. Lol

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13 hours ago, Reality vs Adventure said:

That's how you create 'scientific martyrs' like Galileo who the Catholic church prosecuted for saying Earth revolves around the sun and not the other way around. Church and state should always be separated, otherwise science gets attacked. Under the trump administration, he banned 7 words from the CDC: diversity, entitlement, evidence-based, fetus, science-based, transgender, and vulnerable. And they also interfered with CDC reports about Covid to disinform the people, and even appointed a goon to put in charge of the CDC who was forced to go on leave of absence for being delusional, inciting violence, and being extremely politically polarized. 

I don’t understand how you could ask if atheism is right. You categorize atheism as a belief but it’s not an organization. They don’t get tax breaks for being atheist. They don’t knock on your door. They don’t baptize. And they don’t sing choir or hymns from scriptures. Atheism isn’t right or wrong. It's just rational. 

Well, myself, despite conservative views, I have to admit the "idea of eternal Hell" was a misinterpretation of scripture.  I mean, with the Bible teaching that, it's not surprising so many are cynical of religion.   In fact, much of the church for a long time was highly corrupt with corrupt scripture.  The Bible, itself, calls it religious Babylon.  It's in Revelations.

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7 hours ago, Jayson said:

Well, myself, despite conservative views, I have to admit the "idea of eternal Hell" was a misinterpretation of scripture.

 

Really? That seems to pretty much exactly how it's described to me:

 

Quote

But as for the cowardly, the faithless, the detestable, as for murderers, the sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars, their portion will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur, which is the second death.

Revelation 21:8

 

Quote

And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

Matthew 25:46

 

Quote

But I say to you that everyone who is angry with his brother will be liable to judgment; whoever insults his brother will be liable to the council; and whoever says, ‘You fool!’ will be liable to the hell of fire.

Matthew 5:26

 

Quote

They will suffer the punishment of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might

Second Epistle to the Thessalonians 1:9

 

@Jayson, I'm not really calling you out this time. This is one of the major problems with the Bible itself.  It's a compilation of stories that were passed on through decades if not centuries by word of mouth by a mostly illiterate society.  It was written by mostly unknown authors then much later retranscribed and translated from multiple different languages to multiple other different languages multiple times.

 

So even if we were to make the assumption that there was any initial truth to any chapter of any book in the Bible, how could anyone possibly sit there and say "this is reliable"?  I mean fuck, going from the Latin Bibila Vulgata to the King James English version there are hundreds of mistakes from just that one direct transcription from page to page alone.

 

Now I can't speak for everybody, but this is reason I'm so cynical about Religion and Christianity in particular in this case.  It's a "this is what happened, because I said so!" mentality and I'm sorry, but that's just not good enough.

 

With all this in mind not exactly surprising, just like you said, that Bible study pulls out tons of contradictions and misinterpretations.

Edited by Crazycrab
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18 hours ago, Jayson said:

Kids shouldn't be exposed to the extreme cultural left agenda.  Well, at the least, states should be free to decide if they want Critical Race Theory etc. taught in schools or not.  A lot of people simply don't agree with it.  These people are not monsters or KKK.  They just aren't into the "extreme cultural left".

The teaching of Critical Race Theory isn't actually a thing. No public school system in the country teaches it. It's a talking point from right wing radicals to use as a base to attack freedoms. They use it to attack teachers and education in general. They have decided that when all else fails, to make up something completely false and try that. They're pulling shit out of their ass (no pun intended) that is so far out of left field it's circling the moon. They're insane. Plain and simple.

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